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People might then ask: At the present time rulers are not absent from the empire, why then is there disorder in the empire? Mozi said: The political leaders of the present day are quite different from those of old. The case is parallel to that of the Five Punishments with the Prince of Miao. In ancient times, the sage-kings made the code of the Five Punishments and put the empire in order. But when the Prince of Miao established the Five Punishments they unsettled his empire. Can it be that the Punishments are at fault? Really the fault lies in their application. The "Penal Code of Lu" among the books of the ancient kings, says: "Among the people of Miao punishments were applied without employing instruction and admonition. They made a code of five tortures and called it law." This is to say, those who know how to apply punishments can govern the people with them. And those who do not know, make five tortures out of them. Can it be that the punishments are at fault? Only, when their application is not to the point do they become five tortures. And, also, "Shu Ling", among the books of the ancient kings, says: "The same mouth can produce friendship or produce war." This is to say that he who can use the mouth well will produce friendship, and he who cannot will stir up the enemies and the besieging barbarians. Can it be that the mouth is at fault? The fault really lies in its use which stirs up the enemies and the besieging barbarians. 1. 天鬼之福可得也。萬民之所便利而能彊從事焉，則萬民之親可得也。其為政若此，是以謀事，舉事成，入守固， : Moved to entry 7. 孫詒讓《墨子閒詁》
2. 上者天鬼有厚乎其為政長也，下者萬民有便利乎其為政長也。天鬼之所深厚而彊從事焉，則 : Moved to entry 7. 孫詒讓《墨子閒詁》
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